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Inferno? Purgatorio. E-mail
Written by Pat Lackey   
Monday, 26 January 2009 21:39

Are you then that Virgil, and that fountain, that pours out so great a river of speech? O, glory and light to other poets, may that long study, and the great love that made me search your work, be worth something now. You are my master , and my author: you are alone are the one from whom I learned the high style that has brought me honor. See the creature that I turned back from: O, sage, famous in wisdom, save me from her, she that makes my veings and pulse tremble. --Dante's Inferno, Canto I

OK, so that's probably asking a bit much from Virgil Vasquez. But I did find myself in a classic literature class at Duquesne four years ago in which I head to read Virgil's Aeneid and Dante and dammit, when I have a chance to put some of that into action, well I'm going to do it.

There are two ways you can possibly react to the news that the Pirates claimed Virgil Vasquez. You can shrug and say, "Oh well, we need as many arms as we can get next year," which is about what I did, or you can be upset and say something along the lines of, "HOW COULD THE PIRATES CLAIM VIRGIL VASQUEZ OFF OF WAIVERS WHEN BEN SHEETS IS A FREE AGENT?!? GAWD THIS FRONT OFFICE IS CLUELESS, WE'RE NEVER GOING TO WIN."

The dichotomy of the reaction about describes where Pirate fans are right now. There's a great discussion about this at Bucs Dugout today between Charlie and Dejan, stemming from Dejan's blog post this morning discussing that very divide. If you haven't yet, I strongly recommend that you take some time and read the entire discussion. It's a very interesting discussion about both the future of the Pirates and what happens when blogging and reporting cross paths.

While I may have some more to add to the second part of that discussion in the future, right now I'm mostly concerned with the future of the Pirates. And the only thing I can add to the conversation is this: if you honestly believe that the Pirates can rebuild  and contend at the same time in 2009, you are wrong. This off-season, the Yankees added half a billion dollars in future salary through free agency and they still might be the third best team in the AL East. Think about that for a second. They went out and signed CC Sabathia, AJ Burnett, Mark Teixeira, and now have brought Andy Pettitte back, and they still might not be a playoff team. The Pirates, while they may have enough money to support a much larger payroll than the one they're going to take the field with in 2009, certainly can't bankroll the kind of off-season the Yankees did.

And that's the problem. The Pirates can certainly afford a few one-year deals right now and if guys like Adam Dunn or Bobby Abreu or Ben Sheets are amenable, the Pirates certainly might be able to swoop in in February and pick up one or two of them the way they did with Sanders, Lofton, and Suppan in 2003, then deal them at the deadline for something they wouldn't have had to start with. And so long as the draft and Latin American scouting budget remain untouched, there's nothing wrong with that. But none of those moves are going to make the Pirates competitive and if the price isn't right, there's no reason to get bent out of shape over the Pirates not signing anyone.

The Pirates have been losing for 16 years. When you really break it down, 50 or 62 or 70 or 85 wins are all fungible if the Pirates don't make the playoffs. All that matters right now in 2009 is what the Pirates do to set themselves up for the future. It's terrible and it's awful that we as fans have to think like this, but it's not Neal Huntington's fault.

It's true that the front office will eventually be judged on big league results, but there's nothing to judge right now. If in 2012, the Pirates are a Bobby Abreu or Ben Sheets-type player away from competing for the NL Central and the team sits on their hands with a $50 million payroll, yeah, I'm going to be as pissed about it as anyone. But for now, it's hard to ignore the money being spent in Latin America. It's impossible to ignore the talent that last year's draft brought in. You can't look at the farm system right now and tell me that it's not better than it was when Littlefield was in charge. Will this yield better future results for the club? It's true that I can't say with certainty that it will, but I can say that for the first time since I've started blogging (and we're almost to four years now), I feel like the team is headed somewhere.

Let's do this. Right now, I'll write down Goldstein's top 11, Sickels' top 10, and WTM's top 20. In a year, when these lists come out again, we'll reevaluate. THEN, we'll have something to judge. Is the farm system still moving forward? Is it moving backwards? How did the trades from the 2008 deadline really pan out? What moves did Huntington make in 2009? Yeah, it's a year from now. Yeah, it sucks to wait that long. But you can't build a baseball team overnight.


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Comments (19)add comment

Jackson Tim said:

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I thought for sure that you were using the Dante quote to get to..."Abandon all hope, ye who enter here." You know, the welcome banner at Pirate City.
 
January 27, 2009
Votes: +0

Pat said:

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Heh, well, JT, I'd hate to repeat myself:

http://whereisvanslyke.blogspot.com/2006/02/inferno.html
 
January 27, 2009
Votes: +0

gregschuler said:

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I had a lengthy reply all lined up and ready to go (including typos!), but suddenly lost all interest. I refuse to fight against the useful idiots (Stalin had such a way with words) who propoagate exactly what the organization wants. In fact, the Pirates could not contend for the playoffs, but they could do things in a relatively short order to improve the perceptioon of the team among the fanbase - which would mean a better product on the field. Abreu and Dunn are so much better than almost every player in the entire organization, that adding them for any price would help the Pirates win games.

The more I research and read and ponder, the less I believe in the success cycle the smarties swear to. A team can spend money on the amateur talent and provide capable major league ballplayers. If it can't, why try?
 
January 27, 2009
Votes: +0

Pat said:

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They CAN, but why do it? The Pirates could drop $40 million+ this winter and bring in Dunn, Abreu, Sheets, and Hudson, but where does that get them? They're still probably not contenders, it doesn't help them beyond this year because none of those guys will sign long-term with the Pirates, and that becomes a significant amount of cash that's no longer being spent on the draft or somewhere useful to the long-term health of the franchise.

What's the difference in the ten wins those guys get us? Or more likely, the two or three wins that one or two of them get us? You can try and trade those guys, sure, but prospects are tougher and tougher to pry away every year. There certainly will come a time when the front office and ownership's willingness to open up the checkbook will be tested, but that time just isn't now.
 
January 27, 2009
Votes: +0

K said:

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Virgil Vasquez won't be on the 40-man for long.

Please stop with the Adam Dunn talk. He's an overpaid beer league softball player. Well, maybe he won't be quite as overpaid anymore...
 
January 27, 2009
Votes: +0

w.k. kortas said:

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I believe Stalin also said that if 10 percent of an assertion is true, the whole thing should be treated as fact. The idea of building from within is at least 10 percent true, thus the concept is wholly valid. Deny that if you like, but I'd hate to see you marked as an enemy of the people.
 
January 27, 2009
Votes: +0

Pat said:

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Whoa whoa whoa, so we're agreeing with Stalin now? I'm pretty sure Greg didn't mean that as a compliment ...

As a sidenote, I've been called some awful things by FanHouse commenters, but I think being compared to Stalin takes the cake.
 
January 27, 2009
Votes: +0

Curtis said:

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Nyjer Morgan is still supposed to start in LF. Future be dammed, we need someone else out there. If he plays 140 games out there this season we are all going to need lobotomies to get over the horror. I'm just looking out for everyone's mental health here. It's a different kind of investment for the future.
 
January 27, 2009
Votes: +0

Marc said:

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Pat, I don't understand the correlation between Vazquez and Sheetz. Vazquez makes league min, right? Sheetz we aren't sure about so it's not like we can't get sheetz b/c we spent a half mil on Vazquez, if we really want Sheetz, that half mil won't matter.
 
January 27, 2009
Votes: +0

Pat said:

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Pat, I don't understand the correlation between Vazquez and Sheetz.


I was mostly using it as a jumping-off point, but if you're really curious check out the post by the Pointy Haired Blogger (aka, The Former Columnist Who Shall Not Be Named or Seriously, Just Retire Already) at the PG.
 
January 27, 2009
Votes: +0

Matt W said:

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Sheetz throws with a submarine delivery, right?


/relurking after awful pun
 
January 27, 2009
Votes: +0

Phil said:

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I really do not understand the hate for Nyjer Morgan on this blog hahaha. He hit 299 in 07 and 295 last year. He's a great clubhouse guy and I do not see how he could not be a good leadoff hitter in the future.

On another note I agree with Pat. Signing these big time names this year would just be money we could possibly need in the future for a "real run". Yes Pirate Fans, the news is in, this year won't be the year we make that run but we're building once again that 2011 or 2012 could be.
 
January 27, 2009
Votes: +0

Emma said:

January 27, 2009
Votes: +0

Caus said:

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wouldn't that be a great way to celebrate the 20th anniversary of our last winning season?? by seeing everything NH has been working towards pay off!
 
January 27, 2009
Votes: +0

Deaner said:

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It's not a bad pickup in my opinion... I live in Toledo and saw him pitch a gem for the Mud Hens this past summer.
 
January 27, 2009
Votes: +0

gregschuler said:

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They shouldn't try to do anything - the Pirates make a profit simply by existing. And the point of most businesses is to do just that - make money. If the discussion is should the Pirates try to win - then yes, the team should make every effort in every conceivable way to improve the organization - no arguments there.

But the "tried and true" success cycle isn't the only way. The "Cleveland" method isn't draft and develop - it's take advantage of idiot GMs on other teams and pick up Cliff Lee, Grady Sizemore and Travis Hafner and sprinkle in a few mid-level free agents and watch the team fluctuate from year to year. That's what the Pirates aspire to - very few teams are completely developed internally.

And yes, by signing a marquee free agent, especially now when options are few and time is short, sends a very powerful message to the dwindling and impatient fanbase. We listen and care. We know the organization won't be "good" until 2011, if we catch all the breaks, but bear with us and here, enjoy a competitive baseball team. Because signing Abreu and Dunn will not take playing time away from anyone that "needs" or "deserves". Taking playing time away because you're after Hinske and Gonzalezis foolish and short-sighted.

The day this team breaks that losing streak, they will gain a large measure of redemption from the fanbase and earn themselves more time to build the organization. The longer that it takes, the worse it gets. But again, if all the Pirates want to do is make money, then who cares? Because the actions of this organization, regardless of the front office since 1997 has been to cut costs everywhere. Who's to say that the money going to Latin America didn't come from the big league payroll? Or that because Kyle Stark doesn't want anyone questioning the Pirates way, they save money by hiring cheaper staff members in the minors, possibly compromising the quality of the instruction and jeopardizing the development of those vaunted prospects.
 
January 28, 2009
Votes: +0

gregschuler said:

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Comrade, we both know that the dialectic is in a constant state of flux. We know that only greater glory of the Workers and the glorious Pirate nation are all that matters. Comrade Connelly and Comrade Nutting say so and we dedicate ourselves to their cause!

Also, I heard you say Gesundheit, which proves you are a German spy. The Black Maria is on its way.
 
January 28, 2009
Votes: +0

gregschuler said:

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I wasn't comparing Comrade Lackey to Comrade Stalin, but rather using a term of affection to describe people that refuse to criticize the organization because they're new and better! A better future awaits!

I am no fan of the murdering Georgian, but it is just one of his better phrases. Although to be fair, it was more likely something attributed to him rather than something he said.

Useful idiots - such a compelling phrase.
 
January 28, 2009
Votes: +0

gregschuler said:

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If the Pirates can't spend money in 2012 because they spent money in 2009, fold the club. Or be honest and admit, we're in it for the money. Signing Dunn to a three year deal for say 10 million a season shouldn't bankrupt the team, and if it does, then the Pirates are frauds.

You can argue, as some do, that signing Dunn means less time for other players, but Dunn is automatically better than everyone on the roster right now, even McLouth. And Dunn is 27 years old - it's not like he a 41 yo Luis Gonzalez. Dunn is a great player, despite what Marty Brenneman thinks. Dunn may not want to come to Pittsburgh, but if he does, the Pirates should be on the phone trying to get Dunn signed.

Dunn will still be a good player, maybe still a great player, when the Pirates expect to contend in 2012 (funny how that date keeps slipping in the media discussions, isn't it?).
 
January 28, 2009
Votes: +0

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